onionsoupmix ([info]onionsoupmix) wrote,
@ 2008-05-19 21:47:00
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Entry tags:hashkafa, science

My Simple Plan to Save the World
 
This blog has a faithful reader who is worried about me. Specifically, the reader is worried about the copious amounts of loshon horah I spew forth on a weekly basis. The reader occasionally sends me books or pamphlets on loshon horah. I have found these to be most enlightening.  A recent set of divrei torah, for example, pointed out that when Jews speak Loshon Horah, this gives power to the Soton. The Soton then channels this energy into... drum- role, yes, you guessed it, Science!  

From here:

Where did all this come from? As Rabbi Kessin has pointed out, if the Jews sin, then the Soton receives the flow of Divine energy, twists it into a physical caricature of its spiritual form, and gives it to the nations. In this case, the light of Moshiach, a divine wisdom which gives insight into the spiritual worlds, was converted into a body of knowledge that shows the mechanics of the physical world. And what is that? Science....

Since all the advances in science came ultimately from the Soton, who had taken the ohr Moshiach that had been meant for us, had twisted it into a force for understanding the physical world, and had given it to the nations, we must take another attitude every time that we visit one of those big-box electronics stores to buy yet another appliance. As we gaze in wonder at the latest super-small, yet super-speedy computers (far faster than last year’s model) and marvel at the latest that technology has wrought, a sad thought must cross our minds: “All this is but a perverted shadow of what was really meant – for us!” 

Says Rabbi Kessin: Look at the damage done by loshon hora. Not only does a Jew’s speaking or believing loshon hora enable the Soton to prosecute him and then punish him, but this sin also gives the Soton the ability to take the kedushah which was meant for us, pervert it, and give it to the nations, who then can use it against us. Furthermore, when the Soton is able to take from the ohr Moshiach, the advent of Moshiach is delayed, and he is able to continue his destruction in ways never imagined before...


So my simple plan to save the world is that we should all take great care to speak lots of loshon horah every day. That way, science will advance rapidly, much quicker than now. Cures for horrible diseases will be found, technology will find new ways to grow plentiful crops for starving people in third world nations, natural disasters will be predicted and averted, the environment will be cleaner, foreign policies will change and people will be much happier. Gas prices will go down. The housing market will finally bounce back. All because of the loshon hora that you and I speak, imagine that! 

So let's divide up the day. I will be happy to take the 9am-12pm slot and talk loshon horah for at least those three hours every day. Anyone else? Come on, I know it's hard, but it is for the greater good.




(Post a new comment)


[info]hannahsarah
2008-05-20 02:34 am UTC (link)
Ooh, count me in! One of my best friends would just LOVE to find a chemotherapy that doesn't make her throw up all the time. If I took on an extra hour in her merit, could we actually CURE her cancer? It's stage 4, but I bet if we all pull together we could do it!

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-20 02:59 am UTC (link)
See, that's the spirit, now you're getting the hang of it. It might make us all into devil worshippers or whatever, but I'm all for it if it helps science.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Oh, sweet Lord!
(Anonymous)
2008-05-20 03:15 am UTC (link)
That is HILARIOUS!!

(Reply to this)


[info]schwevy
2008-05-20 03:15 am UTC (link)
i would LOVE to speak lashon hara for as long as it takes if science is going to benefit! i can think of a million reasons why science being strong would make the world a happier place.

maybe if i had spoken MORE lashon hara, my father in law would have survived instead of dying when he was sixty pounds dripping wet after suffering from colon cancer for two years.....

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-20 01:35 pm UTC (link)
All those anti-loshon hora campaigns are apparently not helping medical progress. We should speak out against them, too.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]zachkessin
2008-05-20 06:42 am UTC (link)
Just want to point out that I am not related to this Rabbi Kessin (or any other for that matter). The only rabbi I am related to, save those related to my wife, is Rabbi Small of mystery novel fame, and he is fictional.


That being said I have no idea what that means.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

and he is fictional
[info]o_aronius
2008-05-20 08:23 am UTC (link)
And non-orthodox :)

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: and he is fictional - [info]zachkessin, 2008-05-20 08:39 am UTC

[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-20 11:27 am UTC (link)
Don't worry, I didn't even think about you:)
I usually read people's usernames as one big thing and thought yours was some kind of russian nickname, zacheskin or something.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]zachkessin, 2008-05-22 07:15 am UTC

[info]zyama_krendel
2008-05-20 09:05 am UTC (link)
A very, very good plan. The only thing that bothers me that it obviously contradicts the basic idea of piousness, according to which the humanity is supposed to live in wooden huts, move around on horses and donkeys, have, lo aleinu, an infant mortality rate at about 50%, life expectancy at about 50-60 years, with a lot of people actually starving to death because of simple lack of food, etc. In short, without all those disgusting thing the science has brought to the world...

I am really lost about what happens in those people's minds.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-20 11:19 am UTC (link)
I am really lost about what happens in those people's minds.
It is simple. They just equate science with atheim, internet porn and unkosher cell phones. They do not think about infant mortality and all that.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]zyama_krendel, 2008-05-20 11:23 am UTC
sorry to rain on your parade but.....
[info]march_30
2008-05-20 09:36 am UTC (link)
1) Science is the handmaiden of Torah (Maimonides)
2) Knowledge of science is the path to loving the Almighty (Maimonides)
3) AdvaNCE IN BOTH THEORETICAL PHYSICS and technology is a part of the messianic process (Rabbi MM Schneerson)
4) There is a fundamental relationship between Divine Knowledge and scientific knowledge (Rabbi MM Schneerson)

Since no Orthodox rabbi worth his salt would argue with Maimonides AND Rabbi Schneerson, if Rabbi Kessin articulated the positions described by OSM, he may be Reformed or at best Conservative. Now, I am not knocking those movements, but since mostly Orthodox rabbis get quoted around here, I wante to share this you.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: sorry to rain on your parade but.....
[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-20 11:16 am UTC (link)
maybe read up a little bit on the link about the authors. I doubt that Rav Aaron Feldman would give his haskama to a reform or conservative set of teaching...
http://www.divrei.org/haskomah.htm

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Re: sorry to rain on your parade but.....
[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-20 11:23 am UTC (link)
Rabbi Mendel Kessin

Rabbi Kessin was ordained by Rabbi Moshe Feinstein. He has a PhD in Psychology from Fordham University in NY and runs a private practice in Brooklyn. Rabbi Kessin is a noted lecturer and educator and has spoken extensively in the United States, South Africa, Canada and Israel on Jewish Philosophy.

http://www.gatewaysonline.com/guests.asp


(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]march_30, 2008-05-20 12:47 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]schwevy, 2008-05-21 01:50 am UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but.....
(Anonymous)
2008-05-20 03:55 pm UTC (link)
"Since no Orthodox rabbi worth his salt would argue with Maimonides AND Rabbi Schneerson"

As for Maimonides, while we all respect him, only the Yemenites follow his Pesakim. That means that all others, by definition, argue with him, at least about the Halakha. Many Rabbies did and do respectfily argue with Maimonides.

Rabbi Schneerson was controversial in his lifetime and many argued with him, both Hasidic and non-Hasidic. After his death (Petirah) the amount of people who argue with him just went up as many in the MO world joined the argument.

On the other hand Rabbi Kessin represents the anti-science, anti-knowledge - circle-the-wagons approach that the Haredi world took in the last few years. Whether this approach would really be useful to keep their current flock inside the folds and gain new belivers is yet to be seen. However, I know that OSM geve her suggestion with tongue in cheek, but frankly, I wish she wouldn't go that way for two reasons:
a) Gossip is not exactly the nicest thing in the world.
b) While science has its benefits, it also has drawbacks, so we should be mor causious with it.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]onionsoupmix, 2008-05-20 03:59 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]march_30, 2008-05-20 04:25 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]onionsoupmix, 2008-05-20 04:39 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]march_30, 2008-05-20 05:20 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]schwevy, 2008-05-21 01:51 am UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]march_30, 2008-05-21 02:05 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]schwevy, 2008-05-21 02:07 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]march_30, 2008-05-21 02:17 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]onionsoupmix, 2008-05-21 02:39 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]march_30, 2008-05-21 02:51 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]bringing_peace, 2008-05-30 02:38 am UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]bringing_peace, 2008-05-30 02:37 am UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]schwevy, 2008-05-30 03:15 am UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]march_30, 2008-05-20 05:45 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - (Anonymous), 2008-05-20 05:46 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - [info]march_30, 2008-05-20 05:56 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - (Anonymous), 2008-05-20 07:17 pm UTC
Re: sorry to rain on your parade but..... - (Anonymous), 2008-05-20 07:20 pm UTC

[info]kmelion
2008-05-20 09:38 am UTC (link)
Finally! Someone is claiming that Lashon Harah is the root of all evil and not women's lack of Tznius!

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-20 11:11 am UTC (link)
I guess we'll take progress in any way we can :)

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(no subject) - [info]introducingyael, 2008-05-20 12:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]onionsoupmix, 2008-05-20 01:05 pm UTC
The root of all evil - [info]march_30, 2008-05-20 01:18 pm UTC
Re: The root of all evil - [info]onionsoupmix, 2008-05-20 01:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]llennhoff, 2008-05-20 08:13 pm UTC
who needs latex - [info]march_30, 2008-05-22 01:15 pm UTC
Re: who needs latex - [info]bringing_peace, 2008-05-30 02:39 am UTC

(Anonymous)
2008-05-20 03:15 pm UTC (link)
Brilliant. Especially as this nut has a PhD in science! (well psychology is science of the mind).
What a hypocrit...or maybe he was utilizing everyone's lashon hara before the satan got in on the act.

Anyway, if lashan hara will cure cancer i am all for it.
R

(Reply to this)

Concealment is also a type of loshon horah.
[info]24816
2008-05-20 04:07 pm UTC (link)
First, you didn’t mention that your link is a continuation of personal dimension of loshon horah link: http://www.divrei.org/new_page_37.htm . It is somewhat important because in the first link the reader gets used to the language and can sense that Soton is simply one-sided materialism, while angels are sort of functions, or bureaucratic laws.

Next, you forgot that Rabbi Kessin admits: “Certainly we have benefited from the many advances in science, along with the rest of the world.”

But he goes on to describe the WOBBLING of modern advances: “Science, however, can be construed to present a form of reality that does not include Hashem, chas v’shalom.”
To paraphrase – the electronic toys lure people into empty lives that perpetuates Internet lashon hara and in turn bloats mundane out of proportion.

And don’t you see the similarity between imposing all the isms on Jews?

The ultimate question is who is a hypocrite after all?
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=3020

-FI

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Concealment is also a type of loshon horah.
[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-20 04:35 pm UTC (link)
The link you have is to an article written by John Ray, a bigot and bit of antisemite.
http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0geu5RT.jJIlE4AMJxXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTEzdnVhZG5nBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMwRjb2xvA2FjMgR2dGlkA0gxMThfMTE2/SIG=12m7sndc9/EXP=1211386835/**http%3a//ray-dox.blogspot.com/2007/05/semitism-and-antisemitism.html

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Is he more anti-Semite than Jewish bloggers? - [info]24816, 2008-05-20 04:46 pm UTC
What’s so hard to understand? You are just scratching the surface & ridiculing your meager finding - [info]24816, 2008-05-23 03:12 pm UTC
This is a Rabbi who needs to work on his history...
[info]march_30
2008-05-20 05:12 pm UTC (link)
The Rabbis I have met on my journey have been knowledgeable, and where they did not possess knowledge, they said so and sought it out.
You all can then understand how perturbed I was when I clicked on to the original source on "Divrei" Torah and was utterly horrified to see a gross distortion of history.

Rabbi Kessin writes:
"Still, what happens when the Soton grows? What does he do with his newfound power? Look at the destruction of the First Bais HaMikdash. Within a century after that terrible day, a number of significant developments occurred in the non-Jewish world. For one thing, the city of Rome became a republic and began its ascent to power. In addition, Greece entered its “Golden Era” of knowledge and philosophy, with such individuals as Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, and Pythagoras laying the foundations for what is today called Western civilization. To the east, Buddhism, Confucianism, and Taoism were all founded in that century."

Let me begin by remarking that almost all classic "Haredi" Rabbinic scholars use the Judaic dating which places the destruction of the Temple at 423 BCE (not 586 BCE). You can’t play both sides of the fence


1) The Roman republic begins in 509 BCE much earlier than the fall of Temple I –and it attained no real power until about 300 BCE –well after the Temple II was standing.

2) Pythagoras died about 490 BCE – again 70 years too early

3) Aristotle was born in 384 BCE but dies 30 years after the rebuilding of the Temple

4) Socrates –maybe –he dies 24 years after 423 BCE – but formulated his philosophy whilst Jeremiah was still trying to save the Temple –well before its destruction.

5) Plato was the only one who flourished at this time period

6) Laozi was born around 500 –no dice again

7) Confucius died in 479 BCE

So our Rabbi is either playing hard and fast with the dates (using the secular dating for the Temple fall when it suits him, and I am sure, using the classic Judaic dates when it suits him) –or is completely off by at least 60-70 years.

This is the sort of pious fraud the Jesuits used to pull, but I would expect better from a Haredi rabbi


(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: This is a Rabbi who needs to work on his history...
[info]24816
2008-05-20 06:01 pm UTC (link)
In our long history 60-70 years seems to be within the margin, don't you think? I would be proud if I erred only that much.
-FI

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: This is a Rabbi who needs to work on his history... - [info]march_30, 2008-05-20 06:09 pm UTC
Either way, something must have been in the air. - [info]24816, 2008-05-20 06:16 pm UTC
Re: Either way, something must have been in the air. - [info]march_30, 2008-05-20 06:31 pm UTC
Re: Either way, something must have been in the air. - [info]24816, 2008-05-20 06:50 pm UTC
Re: Either way, something must have been in the air. - [info]zevabe, 2008-05-21 04:15 am UTC
From Bartley Kulp - I hate to rain on everybodies parade.
(Anonymous)
2008-05-21 10:02 am UTC (link)
Rabbi Kessin is merely articulating the view of Rav Moshe Chaim Luzzato of whom the Vilna Goan said that if he was alive 70 yrs. previously, he would have traveled to Genoa Italy to learn in the dust of his feat. The Vilna Goan was no Luddite as we can see from the way he excelled in science. Neither was the Ramchal. By the way you all should know that aside from being the greatest Kabbalist since the time of the Arizal, he was also a poet and a playwriter.

If one understands the Ramchal properly he in no way pasuls science. Rav Kessin is merely demonstrating through the Torah of the Ramchal how history is effected by our actions through cause and effect. Again, even the Lubavitcher Rebbe ZT"l would not argue with him on this issue. They both are merely giving descriptions from a different angle to the same object. It has been pointed out in Lubavitch circles that the advent of spreading pnimius hatorah through Chassidus and the rapid scientific advances during that time period (the enlightenment) is interlinked. It is discussed that a great light of chochma was reveled in the world. Whatever could not be retained through torah came out in science.

Rav Kessin using the Ramchal's torah which describes how cause and effect works, is giving a deeper insight into how this works. Both the torah and science are forms of chochma. He writes that chochma which is the matter of all created things is constantly coming down from above to below to giving sustanence to creation. When we do mitzvot properly then we are sustained through cochma which is holy. This is a plus for all of creation. When we do not we get it through other channels. Namely the profane. This is not to say that the profane is tuma. It just means that we have to work harder in lifting the profane to be of holy use. Just because chochma has fallen to the otherside does not mean that we should dicard it. We have to work towards bringing back these holy sparks. Again Rav Schneerson would not disagree with these ideas. This by the way is the idea of the menorah with eight lights. Seven of the lights symbolize the seven chochmot and the eighth one torah. In otherwords sciences real intrinsic value is only reveled when it is used as a vehicle for torah.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Science and Orthodoxy
[info]march_30
2008-05-21 01:30 pm UTC (link)
1) Rabbi M.M. Schneerson's position seems to be:
The advance during the 19th century in the availability of the inward dimensions of Torah and the advances of science are two sides of a single coin, one spiritual, and one worldly, but they are an interlaced dynamic. It is not correct that "That which could not come out in Torah came out in science", but rather the same manifestation of the Divine wisdom drives both. By way of example: All things being equal, an increase in one dimension of a cube made of substance "x" will increase its total surface area and its mass, although those are two different qualities.

2) Can someone provide the precise location of the "GRA" "Aristotle is evil" quote?

(Reply to this) (Parent)

From Bartley Kulp - One more thing.
(Anonymous)
2008-05-21 10:21 am UTC (link)
I almost forgot to mention that Rav Kessen that Lashon Hara acts as a mechanism to deflect the chochma that is being sent to us to the other side. If we could just retain that chochma properly, redemption would come quicker. Now we have to work hard at extracating this chochma from where it is trapped.

Just to make a quote from Harav Hagoan Billy Joel which will help with this ideah; "I've gotta get it right the first time that's the main thing, I can't afford to let it pass, You get it right the next time that's not the same thing, Gonna have to make the first time last."

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: From Bartley Kulp - One more thing.
[info]24816
2008-05-21 02:20 pm UTC (link)
Thanks!
-FI

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Re: From Bartley Kulp - One more thing. - [info]march_30, 2008-05-21 02:20 pm UTC
From Bartley Kulp - about Billy Joel. - (Anonymous), 2008-05-22 02:42 pm UTC
Higher up - [info]24816, 2008-05-22 02:44 pm UTC
Re: Higher up - [info]onionsoupmix, 2008-05-22 02:50 pm UTC
Re: Higher up - [info]24816, 2008-05-22 02:51 pm UTC
From Bartley Kulp - Just two corrections.
(Anonymous)
2008-05-21 10:55 am UTC (link)
One is that the Ramchal was from Padua and not Genoa. The other is that the Ramchal did not stress so much on lifting sparks. That is more a Chassisic thing. Rav Kessim writes from the Ramchal that the lights of redemption in the form of chochma are always descending upon us. We push it away to the the other side when we speak Lashon Hara. The Ramchal writes that it will be the Moshiach ben Yoseph's job to lift the seven chochmot from the clipot.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Luzzato
[info]march_30
2008-05-21 01:54 pm UTC (link)
It was said that the Rabbi Luzzato "was the greatest Kabbalist since Rabbi Luria

However, i remember seeing that he quotes Nathan of Gaza, who was Shabbatai Zvi's claimed prophet. Would this not raise the question of Sabbatean tendencies on the part of Rabbi Luzzato? I thought all the Orthodox groups rejected Shabbatai Zvi?

I know that both Maimonides' writings and Chassidism were also banned by the rabbinical establishment before they were accepted by the masses of Orthodoxy -but I find this case to somewhat different as the Sabbateans have never been accepted

Here is qoute from the "Jewish Virtual Library"

"When word got out of Luzzatto's messages, the rabbis of Venice became alarmed, considering such mystical activities dangerous. They thought that Luzzatto and his followers might be a Shabbatean heretical group, one of many who followed the teachings of the false messiah, Shabbatai Tzvi. Luzzatto admitted to being influenced by the writings of Nathan of Gaza, Shabbatai Tzvi's "prophet." He claimed that the positive elements of Shabbatai Tzvi's teachings could be separated from the heretical elements, but few rabbinic authorities agreed with this opinion, since Shabbateanism was a powerful wave sweeping over the Jewish community. A bitter controversy ensued concerning the verity and propriety of Luzzatto's activities and claims. Some authorities in the Jewish community claimed that Luzzatto was not a proper recipient of such revelations, since he was young and unmarried. Tradition has long held that one ought to be married and over the age of 40 to engaged in mystical speculation. Luzzatto's house was searched and evidence that he engaged in magical practices was found. He was compelled to cease and desist from teaching Kabbalah and disclosing messages from the "maggid." However, Luzzatto continued to write about Kabbalah. His marriage, in 1731, was seen as symbolic of the union of the Shechinah and her divine husband. Despite his marriage, the controversy continued and, under pressure, Luzzatto left for Amsterdam in 1735, where he lived until 1734 writing about Kabbalah but not teaching mystical practices any longer."

(Reply to this) (Parent)

"It's not the snake but the sin that kills . . "
(Anonymous)
2008-05-21 02:01 pm UTC (link)
There wouldn't be a need for those scientific advances.

If we were more righteous then we wouldn't have war, famine, disease, "high gas prices (we'd be driving electric cars anyway, but that's a different post), natural disasters will be averted, the environment will be cleaner, foreign policies will change, and people will be happier." -this week's parsha

Or we can muddle through with science. Your choice.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: "It's not the snake but the sin that kills . . "
[info]march_30
2008-05-21 02:17 pm UTC (link)
I would suggest that if we were more Godly we would not be using our technological and scietific ability to make ever better instruments of death and make money using mathematics to manipulate the markets enriching fat cat Upper West Side hedge fund people at the expense of ordinary people losing their jobs and houses, but instead we would use all that scientific effort to end disease and hunger and create the kind of world Maimonides talks about at the very end of the Mishnah Torah

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Re: "It's not the snake but the sin that kills . . " - [info]onionsoupmix, 2008-05-21 02:28 pm UTC
Don’t be so sure. - [info]24816, 2008-05-21 02:42 pm UTC
So geometry is Satanic...?
(Anonymous)
2008-05-21 03:51 pm UTC (link)
From OSM article:

"Still, what happens when the Soton grows? What does he do with his newfound power? Look at the destruction of the First Bais HaMikdash. Within a century after that terrible day, a number of significant developments occurred in the non-Jewish world. For one thing, the city of Rome became a republic and began its ascent to power. In addition, Greece entered its “Golden Era” of knowledge and philosophy, with such individuals as Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, and Pythagoras laying the foundations for what is today called Western civilization. To the east, Buddhism, Confucianism, and Taoism were all founded in that century."

So, if I understand correctly, this guy is saying that Satan's power was used to show definitively how to calculate the length of the hypotenuse of a right-angled triangle. I'm sure he'll find some struggling math students to agree with him.

JRKmommy

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: So geometry is Satanic...?
[info]bringing_peace
2008-05-30 02:44 am UTC (link)
I'll pass this on to my students.
I'm a math teacher.
ROFL!

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Re: So geometry is Satanic...?
[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-21 04:54 pm UTC (link)
yeah, there was also something there about the Y-contiuum, made me think back to the old Back to the Future movies :)
Here's the quote...
From this time on, Adom�s purpose would no longer be to merely reject the Soton by not allowing it to convince him to eat from the Tree of Knowledge; now that he had indeed been convinced by the Soton, he had to destroy it. How? Hashem so to speak cut the cable leading from Himself to the Soton and reattached it to Adom�s cable, forming an inverted �Y� shape, with one strand going to Adom and the other to the Soton. Hashem then sent down only enough shefa for one side to flourish. Should Adom do mitzvos, he would receive the shefa and therefore both grow and succeed in spirituality and even develop an appetite for more mitzvos. Likewise, the Soton would grow weak and eventually die. However, should Adom sin, he would weaken in his spirituality and therefore feel more attached to the physical world, and the Soton would receive the shefa and grow strong. In any case, however, it was Adom, not the Soton, who determined which way the shefa flowed

(Reply to this) (Thread)

It is not THAT hard to picture.
[info]24816
2008-05-21 05:09 pm UTC (link)
Your choices, priorities, investments, and possessions have a tendency to enslave you and suck up your energy. Think of Pharaoh being punished by losing his freedom of choice.
The good news is that this process is reversible.
-FI

(Reply to this) (Parent)

From Bartley Kulp Re: So geometry is Satanic...? - (Anonymous), 2008-05-22 02:34 pm UTC
Re: From Bartley Kulp Re: So geometry is Satanic...? - [info]onionsoupmix, 2008-05-22 02:53 pm UTC
Re: From Bartley Kulp Re: So geometry is Satanic...? - (Anonymous), 2008-05-22 06:39 pm UTC
Afterthought.
[info]24816
2008-05-29 01:46 pm UTC (link)
I may take part in science advancement though lashon hara by matching your input with personal stories about my children, starting with the oldest one.
These stories might be interesting for your readers and later I can use them in my memoirs. Seems like win-win solution.
-FI

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Afterthought.
[info]onionsoupmix
2008-05-29 05:00 pm UTC (link)
Perhaps you can write stories about your children and post them on YOUR blog.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: Afterthought. - [info]24816, 2008-05-29 05:03 pm UTC

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