onionsoupmix ([info]onionsoupmix) wrote,
@ 2009-06-17 19:38:00
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Entry tags:crazy, criminals, hypocrisy, rabbis

The Dilemma Continues...

Whom should I believe on the Rabbi Glanz  jail  scandal?  The Zionist-controlled evil and Anti-Semitic goyishe media outlets or The Yeshiva World News?

A difficult choice. Was this chaplain guilty of grossly exploiting his position for the dregs of society? Or was he a hero in the mitzvah of Pidyon Shevuim, stopped only by a heartless and cruel mosser?

Frankly, I didn't really care much about this crazy story until YWN published the ridiculous editorial in the above link. I don't particularly care if all the allegations are accurate of if some people are exaggerating a bit. There's always allegations of special treatment for one group or another and maybe the truth is somewhere in between.
 
What ticks me off is that according to YWN, somehow it is now the wicked informant's fault that the poor frum inmates will not have their special privileges and will have to remain with the rest of the population where " who knows, lo aleinu, awaits these prisoners." The chillul Hashem, oddly, was not caused by the criminal behaviors of the frum Jews and not by the immoral actions of the chassidic chaplain. This horrible situation was actually caused by the informant and "only death can be mechaper the chillul Hashem." 

Really now?




(140 comments) - (Post a new comment)


(Anonymous)
2009-06-18 12:20 am UTC (link)
Glowing_flower here (I can't remember my log-on).

My understanding was that it was a corrections officer who brought the situation to light, not another inmate.

That being said, if he paid for the parties, who cares. The problem (beyond the sheer craziness of having a big simcha IN A JAIL) is that the state of New York paid the guards overtime to provide the necessary security at the parties. That means the taxpayers, not the inmate, picked up the bill.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]onionsoupmix
2009-06-18 12:52 am UTC (link)
I guess according to YWN someone sent an anonymous letter to the corrections department.

I'm just not clear on how frum Jews are supposed to observe the mesirah laws if these halachos end up allowing Jews to get away with all kinds of crazy illegal crap. This being a relatively minor example.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]antidos
2009-06-18 12:56 am UTC (link)
Is there a way to enroll in this all included vacation at lower Manhattan ? :)

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]onionsoupmix
2009-06-18 12:59 am UTC (link)
Eh, the price of entry is small- some financial crime. Misplace a few hundred thousand dollars here and there and you should be all set.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]antidos, 2009-06-18 01:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-18 02:50 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-18 12:49 pm UTC

[info]llennhoff
2009-06-18 01:15 am UTC (link)
I'm really sick of hearing this notion that exposing evil deeds is the chillul hashem, rather than performing the deeds themselves. My father s"h taught me "If you don't want to get caught doing something, don't do it." Hss this lesson never made it to the Orthodox world?

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]bringing_peace
2009-06-18 02:36 am UTC (link)
appearantly, not

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]onionsoupmix
2009-06-18 02:48 am UTC (link)
The lesson that made it to the Orthodox world seems to be: if something goes wrong, blame the messenger.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]mindycl
2009-06-18 01:51 am UTC (link)
Rabbi Glanz did not do what he did to gain any personal benefit. He was only trying to make the lives of his fellow Jews in the prison easier. I do think he went way overboard with all the perks he let them have. a bar mitzvah with just 20 couples and no singer wouldve been enough. and the card games and unlimited phone calls was wrong. however, massering him was wrong too! It's going to be a lot harder for jewish inmates now, be they guilty or innocent. The informant simply made life harder now for his fellow Jewish prisoners. What did the informant have to gain from massering on Glanz? nothing. He just wanted to bring Glanz down, and it was all 'SATMAR POLITICS.' ugh!

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]onionsoupmix
2009-06-18 02:46 am UTC (link)
Okay, it's sad that it was satmar politics, but do you really think an inmate deserves to have a bar mitzvah for his kid in jail, with 20 couples? People are in jail to get a punishment and if he makes prison all fun and games for Jewish inmates, what's to stop re-offenders? Massering him was not wrong it should have been done much earlier and for the right reasons, not some political garbage. Maybe if someone had closed up this little operation earlier, there wouldn't be quite as many frum Jews willing to take the risk of prison time.

What if you are that kid? Would you want to go to a jail to have your barmitzvah? There are so many things about this story that I just don't understand.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

a brilliant comment:
[info]bringing_peace
2009-06-18 02:40 am UTC (link)
Mesirah has been around since the days of Moshe Rabbeinu in Mitzrayim. Do we have to give them material to be moser on?

Comment by elicpa — June 17, 2009 @ 8:06 pm

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: a brilliant comment:
[info]onionsoupmix
2009-06-18 02:48 am UTC (link)
I'm surprised that went through. I'll go try write something, see if I make the cut. Don't hold your breath.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Re: a brilliant comment:
[info]onionsoupmix
2009-06-18 12:57 pm UTC (link)
How about this comment:

Why this happened to him nobody will know but every Yid in the DOC system is suffering today because he can no longer take care of them.

Try this - every day for just a week eat a bowl of dry cereal with Cholov Stam milk, have a small coffee (warm only) and an apple for breakfast. For lunch eat an orange, a can of tuna (plain - no mayo or anything)and a cup of juice. For supper have 2 slices of white bread with 2 pieces of vacum packed Turkey roll, a cup of juice and a fruit. THATS IT! Nothing else! oh and also, make sure only to use plastic utensils.

Can you do that for a week? How about a month? A year? how about 3 years? SAME THING EVERY SINGLE DAY WITHOUT A CHANGE…..

You can’t do it. you know you can’t. well, our fellow Yidden in prison (whether they belong there or not) this is their diet provided to them. Nothing else. Stop for a moment now and let that sink in…………..

Reb Arye is a LIFESAVER. He brings them real food. He brings them love. He lifts their spirits. He reminds them they are human. He tells them how things are going at home. He makes them smile when they would rather be dead. He talks in learning with them. He does everything humanly possible to make them feel even a little better even if it for just a few minutes.


OH NOEZ. The poor inmate will have to live on TUNAFISH and drink CHOLOV STAM milk and eat TURKEY SANDWICHES for dinner every night. HOW AWFUL. I am going to go say tehillim right now for them.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

menue - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-19 01:14 am UTC

[info]hannahsarah
2009-06-18 03:29 am UTC (link)
The *ehem* "journalism" at the Post is painful to read. The editorial at the YWN was almost as unintelligible. Where did these people learn how to write? The bias on both sides is bad enough to make me not want to care about either side.

(Reply to this)


(Anonymous)
2009-06-18 07:40 am UTC (link)
Ok, it's pretty clear that the bar mitzvah and engagement party happened, and that the rabbi pulled whatever strings he could to get Jews to one prison instead of the other and to make things easier.

There's no hint that he did this for personal gain - it was likely done out of concern for fellow Jews, albeit in a misplaced way. I remember learning a halacha that we don't praise someone in front of their enemy, because it can cause the enemy to respond with more loshon hora. By the same token - shouldn't we be careful not to do things in such an over-the-top way in a setting where religious/ethnic/racial tensions may be heightened and Jews resented? Obviously, I support basic civil rights and Jewish prisoners have every right to kosher food and chaplains, but a little sechel would have helped.

He couldn't have done any of this without permission from prison officials, so I suspect that the real scandal is their failure to say no to him prior to this.

I don't understand the "mosser" allegation. Correction's officers complained about this, and there was also an anonymous letter. How does Yeshiva News know who the "informant" was? Also - how can you "inform" about something that is obviously already within the knowledge of secular authorities?

JRKmommy

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]onionsoupmix
2009-06-18 12:48 pm UTC (link)
Maybe the informant sent his letter to someone in the media? I don't know. The satmar people seem to be sure that this was a rival satmar group's adherent.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]eshkol_hakofer
2009-06-18 08:50 am UTC (link)
chillul hashem?
are the idiots neo-nazis like "Rabbi Avraham Sherman attacking converts, non-haredi Orthodox rabbis"
'rabbis' like this ain't rabbis,
ain't jewish,
don't represent me.
if a voice comes out from heaven to tell me they are jews, i should
start considering seriously the other form of judaism: qaraism or even apostasy.

(Reply to this)

Crazy Town
(Anonymous)
2009-06-18 12:33 pm UTC (link)
1) Why didn't they take the money they spent on the bar mitzvah and use it to bail the guy out of jail?

2) I'm glad the author of that article is so concerned about the well-being of his fellow Jews. I'm sure the same kindness is shown to people with a different kind of hat on. Or when a gay Jew walks into his shul.

3) Jail is supposed to be UNPLEASANT. If you don't want to go there, do not commit crimes!

(this is Shev, from your HS class. I can't create an account because it's blocked at my work!)

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Crazy Town
[info]onionsoupmix
2009-06-18 12:43 pm UTC (link)
Shev, I don't know that the guy was just being held until trial, I think he was just in jail period.

Also, I'm still wondering how cruel that is to the bar mitzvah kid, to make him have the party in a jail. Can you imagine? Unless it's just not a stigma anymore and the local cell block is just as good venue as any...

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: Crazy Town - (Anonymous), 2009-06-18 07:38 pm UTC
Re: Crazy Town - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-18 10:23 pm UTC
Re: Crazy Town - [info]joshuazelinsky, 2009-06-18 11:50 pm UTC
Re: Crazy Town
[info]zachkessin
2009-06-19 04:01 am UTC (link)
Well last time he was out on bail he split the country and was in hiding for 16 years. so I would assume that the judge was not about to let him do that again and denied him bail. If they think you will run they will do that, and if you have already done it once they won't let you do it again.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Baffled
(Anonymous)
2009-06-18 03:00 pm UTC (link)
I have no words for this: a bar mitzva in prison? An engagement? Hello? When daddy is in prison, we love him still maybe, but we also realise that he has done Bad Things! Prison is meant to be awful!
And the idea that no jew should 'rat on' his fellow jew, just leave it to God would be nice if everyone was totally holy, but has turned out to just be helpful to opportunists. Ooh well, maybe I am too calvinistic in my outlook on 'crime and punishment'

(Reply to this)


[info]llennhoff
2009-06-18 05:27 pm UTC (link)
I don't think that the sole purpose of prison is to be punitive. But even from a rehabilitation stand point letting the prisoner throw parties in jail and have special treats for no other reason than he has an in with the chaplain is counterproductive. What is he learning from that?

(Reply to this)

Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה
[info]24816
2009-06-18 06:22 pm UTC (link)
The problem might be in the difference between Jewish jurisprudence and the secular one.

For example, it makes no sense to extradite a person to another country where the laws are dramatically different from US laws, e.g. if they have no freedom of speech or if they chop off thieves’ hands.

Similarly, I heard that some financial transgressions are not considered criminal in Judaism. Thus I can see how a kind person can get carried away trying to soften the consequences of cruel and unusual punishment.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה
[info]onionsoupmix
2009-06-18 06:25 pm UTC (link)
If you live in America, you have to play by the laws here or risk jail time. Jail is not a cruel and unusual punishment... it is the most usual, in fact.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-18 06:31 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-18 10:39 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - [info]joshuazelinsky, 2009-06-18 11:52 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - [info]joshuazelinsky, 2009-06-19 12:13 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב''ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 03:48 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 01:30 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 01:40 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 05:10 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - (Anonymous), 2009-06-21 06:37 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - (Anonymous), 2009-06-23 01:05 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-23 01:07 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-23 01:11 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-23 01:14 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-23 01:20 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-23 01:22 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-23 01:29 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - (Anonymous), 2009-06-23 01:12 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-19 01:18 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 01:36 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 01:42 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב''ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 03:46 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-19 01:43 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 04:24 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 04:30 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב‘’ ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 04:36 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב‘’ ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 04:46 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב‘’ ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 05:05 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב‘’ ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 08:10 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב‘’ ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 03:47 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב‘’ ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-22 05:04 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב‘’ ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 05:07 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-22 01:53 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב ' ' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 04:12 pm UTC
Whoever is trying to please goym - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-22 04:28 pm UTC
Re: Whoever is trying to please goym, ב’ ‘ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 04:37 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - [info]eshkol_hakofer, 2009-06-19 01:54 am UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 03:31 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]joshuazelinsky, 2009-06-19 04:38 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 04:57 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]joshuazelinsky, 2009-06-19 09:13 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 04:41 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 05:14 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 08:07 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 03:43 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב"ה - (Anonymous), 2009-06-22 04:54 pm UTC
Re: Cruel and unusual punishment? ב' 'ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 05:04 pm UTC
Shalmo
(Anonymous)
2009-06-19 12:59 am UTC (link)
friend live in a jewish orthodox neighborhood

and they charge him more rent because he's not an orthodox jew.

double-standards of the frum world piss me of.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Shalmo
[info]bringing_peace
2009-06-19 01:20 am UTC (link)
A Lakewood apartment building ownder just payed a lot of money b/c s/he was sued just for this.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: Shalmo - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 01:29 am UTC
Re: Shalmo - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-19 01:36 am UTC
Re: Shalmo - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 04:02 pm UTC
What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב''ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 04:01 pm UTC
Re: What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב''ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 04:33 pm UTC
Re: What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 04:42 pm UTC
Re: What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב '' ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 04:51 pm UTC
Re: What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב '' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-19 05:02 pm UTC
Re: What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב '' ה - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-19 08:13 pm UTC
Re: What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב' 'ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 03:56 pm UTC
Re: What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב '' ה - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-22 01:55 am UTC
Re: What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב '' ה - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-22 01:56 am UTC
What’s wrong with giving less risky tenants a break? ב ' ' ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 04:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-22 04:32 pm UTC
You don’t understand ב’ ‘ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 04:40 pm UTC
ome people (e.g. with children) ruin property just by moving in - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-22 01:54 am UTC
Yeah, this paradox didn't escape me, ב’ ‘ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 04:14 pm UTC
Re: Yeah, this paradox didn't escape me, ב’ ‘ה - [info]bringing_peace, 2009-06-22 04:26 pm UTC
Re: Yeah, this paradox didn't escape me, ב’ ‘ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 04:35 pm UTC
Re: Yeah, this paradox didn't escape me, ב’ ‘ה - (Anonymous), 2009-06-22 05:05 pm UTC
Sure, ב’ ‘ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-22 05:10 pm UTC
Shalmo
(Anonymous)
2009-06-20 06:28 am UTC (link)
"24816" I EAT jewish babies for breakfast. My goal in life as an evil goy is murder all follow Psalms to the letter, by dashing their children against rocks.

MUUUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!


(Reply to this) (Thread)

Don’t make a fool of yourself, ב’ ‘ה
[info]24816
2009-06-22 10:42 pm UTC (link)
I grew up among goyim, was married to one, and have pretty objective view of them as well as of secular world.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Aww! I love you too princess - (Anonymous), 2009-06-23 04:58 am UTC
Food for thought, ב’ ‘ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-23 06:10 pm UTC
Interesting ב’ ‘ה - (Anonymous), 2009-06-24 09:54 am UTC
Continuing.....ב’ ‘ה - (Anonymous), 2009-06-24 09:56 am UTC
Pick and chose? ב’ ‘ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-24 06:12 pm UTC
Only Torah is eternal? ב’ ‘ה - (Anonymous), 2009-06-24 09:13 pm UTC
Only Torah is eternal? ב’ ‘ה - (Anonymous), 2009-06-24 09:14 pm UTC
Only Torah is eternal ב’ ‘ה - [info]24816, 2009-06-24 09:22 pm UTC
NAH! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-26 06:15 am UTC
Re: NAH! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-26 06:46 am UTC
Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-27 07:21 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-28 02:35 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-28 10:31 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-28 04:06 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-29 05:35 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-29 10:26 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-30 10:52 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-30 12:01 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-07-01 02:56 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-07-01 03:21 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-07-01 03:47 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-07-01 04:23 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-07-01 04:24 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-07-02 02:09 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-28 10:44 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-28 03:55 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-29 05:45 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-29 10:22 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-30 11:16 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-30 11:55 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-07-01 03:09 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-07-01 03:26 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-07-01 03:41 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-07-01 03:43 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-07-01 04:26 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-07-02 02:12 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-28 10:46 am UTC
Re: Here you go! - [info]onionsoupmix, 2009-06-28 03:49 pm UTC
Re: Here you go! - (Anonymous), 2009-06-29 05:54 am UTC

(140 comments) - (Post a new comment)

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