onionsoupmix: Let's Play My Favorite Game.

onionsoupmix (

onionsoupmix) wrote,
@ 2009-08-07 10:34:00

Entry tags:

crazy, hypocrisy, tznius, women

Let's Play My Favorite Game.

Which one is more crazy?

Door Number One: Fun is goyishe so don't ask me if I like to have fun. From here.

Door Number Two: Going to Walmart is a huge sexual nisyaon for me so please don't ask me to do your shopping. From here.

Door Number Three: Shaindy.com, the primier Orthodox cheating site, is now posting sex stories featuring incest and people named Moishe Shmiel, Hershy and Blimi. From here, but I wouldn't click on this at work. Or when you're eating. They are also looking for a Yiddish-speaking secretary. I'm guessing her name is going to have to be Blimi.

Door Number Four: The people involved in the Syrian money-laundering scam were just fulfilling veahavta lereacha kamocha. A true friend will help you bury the bodies. From here.

Vote! Vote! Vote!

(84 comments) - (Post a new comment)

aunt_becca
2009-08-07 03:08 pm UTC (link)

Door #2....
The website link (door #2) is geared toward frum people who are recovering from addictions, specificly sexual addictions or "lust addictions." It's overseen by Rabbi Dr. Twersky, who is a world-renouned psychiatrist and expert on addiction and recovery. If someone is truly struggling with this type of behavior, sometimes they need to have radical solutions for these problems, lest they be triggered into relapse. In non-frum circles, it's not uncommon for people to drop their addict friends, find new routes to work, really do whatever it takes to not tempt them into relapse. While this seems a bit preposterous to me, who is to say that it *hasn't* helped people prevent a relapse? He's not recommending that everybosy engage in this type of behavior, just those who are dealing with addictive behaviors.
Door #1 is depressing.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	onionsoupmix 2009-08-07 03:14 pm UTC (link)
	I just really have my doubts about the efficacy of any of these sexual addiction treatments. Recidivism rates are very high for that population. (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

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aunt_becca, 2009-08-07 03:17 pm UTC

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-07 03:22 pm UTC

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antidos, 2009-08-07 03:36 pm UTC

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-07 03:22 pm UTC

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antidos, 2009-08-07 03:38 pm UTC

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-07 03:41 pm UTC

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antidos, 2009-08-07 04:44 pm UTC

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goatinamoat, 2009-08-08 09:08 pm UTC

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-09 02:58 am UTC

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goatinamoat, 2009-08-09 03:00 am UTC

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goatinamoat, 2009-08-09 03:01 am UTC

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antidos, 2009-08-09 02:36 pm UTC

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aunt_becca, 2009-08-07 07:08 pm UTC

	antidos 2009-08-07 03:15 pm UTC (link)
	Tough to choose. But I kind of like the last one. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	onionsoupmix 2009-08-07 03:23 pm UTC (link)
	Really? I thought you'd like the third one. Why door number four? (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

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antidos, 2009-08-07 03:29 pm UTC

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-07 03:43 pm UTC

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antidos, 2009-08-07 03:57 pm UTC

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antidos, 2009-08-07 04:05 pm UTC

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-07 04:16 pm UTC

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antidos, 2009-08-07 04:43 pm UTC

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-07 04:52 pm UTC

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antidos, 2009-08-07 05:39 pm UTC

	(Anonymous) 2009-08-07 03:22 pm UTC (link)
	I think including #2 was cruel - it has nothing to do with being frum, the person obviously has a huge problem, I think it is cruel to make fun of him. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	antidos 2009-08-07 03:31 pm UTC (link)
	How about just allowing this guy to have, sorry to mention, s*x with his wife whenever he and she would like to, nothwithstanding with her being a niddah ? (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-07 03:38 pm UTC

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-07 03:37 pm UTC

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onionsoupmix, 2009-08-07 03:50 pm UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2009-08-09 09:27 pm UTC

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ruchel, 2009-08-07 04:15 pm UTC

	bringing_peace 2009-08-07 03:36 pm UTC (link)
	Door Number One: Fun is goyishe so don't ask me if I like to have fun. From here. Убийственная статья! - It sounds scary!!!! (Reply to this) (Thread)

	onionsoupmix 2009-08-07 03:39 pm UTC (link)
	the person sounds perfectly serious too. I also don't understand why they put it up on a shidduch site. Do they really expect people to be like this? (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

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bringing_peace, 2009-08-07 03:47 pm UTC

	llennhoff 2009-08-07 04:11 pm UTC (link)
	I don't know about crazy, but I most dislike #4 (Note: I didn't follow any of the links, just going by your summary, but I read #4 independently). All the others are shtut or narishkeit, but the attitude in #4 is actually held by a significant number of people, and following it turns Judaism into the Mafia. (Reply to this) (Thread)

	onionsoupmix 2009-08-07 04:23 pm UTC (link)
	written by a rabbi too... where do all these people get smicha? Yeshivas HaGanovim v' Hagazlanim? (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

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antidos, 2009-08-07 04:44 pm UTC

In case you are looking for the psychological term... - (Anonymous), 2009-08-12 07:46 am UTC

Thou, O Queen, art the fairest of all ב‘ ’ה

24816
2009-08-07 05:25 pm UTC (link)

Because your hobby is to dig out, explore, and exhibit people’s mistakes and sorrows and you do it for FUN??? But beware, there are other snow-whites sitting pretty in dirty laundry and breathing up your neck.

About sorrows, they may be just the lesser evil. If you understand that it is better for some people to avoid bars, then you should understand that for others it is better to avoid unznes places. Or would you prefer them to go crazy the other way and provide material for your blog?

Also, the sorrows could be compounded and it tells more about those who exaggerate particular aspect of the problem: http://www.7kanal.com/news.php3?id=265591

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	Re: Thou, O Queen, art the fairest of all ב‘ ’ה onionsoupmix 2009-08-07 05:44 pm UTC (link)
	Are you seriously arguing that the FBI arrested all the rabbis b/.c they are antisemites? Seriously? (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: Thou, O Queen, art the fairest of all ב‘ ’ה -

antidos, 2009-08-07 06:52 pm UTC

Re: Thou, O Queen, art the fairest of all ב‘ ’ה -

24816, 2009-08-09 03:00 pm UTC

	fetteredwolf 2009-08-07 06:42 pm UTC (link)
	When I was a kid a rabbi told our class that Jews shouldn't be having fun because there is no word in Hebrew for fun. The word commonly used, kef, comes from Arabic. (Although Russian friends have told me it comes from Russian. Is this true?) (Reply to this) (Thread)

The word "kef" or "kayf" in Russian:

antidos
2009-08-07 06:57 pm UTC (link)

Слово "кайф" вовсе не английское по происхождению, как, наверное, думают многие. Восходит оно к арабскому слову "kaif", что означает - "отдых, приятное безделье". Данная точка зрения уже прочно укоренилась в лингвистической литературе (см., например, Колесов В.В. Язык города. М., 1991).Однако, по моим данным, полученным от носителей современного арабского языка, по-арабски (во всяком случае, сейчас, в конце ХХ-го века) это слово звучит не "кайф", а "кэф", т. е. без "й" (а пишется вот так:). Если же произносить это слово с "й" ("кайф" или "кэйф"), то арабы начинают путать его со словом "кэйфа", что в переводе на русский означает "как".
В турецкой огласовке слово "кайф" звучит как "кейф" (опять же - по традиционной версии), но значение имеет то же самое.

Впервые слово "кайф" ("кейф") в русском языке официально зафиксировано в 1821 году. Именно в этом году О.И. Сенковский, рассказывая о своих путешествиях по Египту, объяснил тогдашней петербургской публике, что такое "кейф":
"Путешественники, бывшие на Востоке, знают, сколь многосложное значение имеет выражение кейф. Отогнав прочь все заботы и помышления, развалившись небрежно, пить кофе и курить табак называется - делать кейф.
В переводе это можно было бы назвать наслаждаться успокоением".

К 1837 году слово "кейф" (в значении "нега") распространилось широко, а в 1838 году его в одном из писем употребил Ф.М. Достоевский.

Помимо Фёдора Михайловича слово "кейф" в своих сочинениях использовали такие маститые классики, как Д.В. Григорович, Н.С. Лесков, Вс. Крестовский, И.А. Гончаров.

Именно от слова "кейф" произошло другое всем хорошо известное слово - "кефир".

В первой половине нашего столетия о "кейфе" как-то забыли. В словарях тех лет слово "кейф" сопровождалось пометкой "устаревшее". Второе "рождение" слово "кейф" (теперь уже в форме "кайф") получило лишь в начале 60-х годов, после прошедшего в Москве Всемирного фестиваля молодежи и студентов (1957 г.). В это время в молодежной среде появилось много английских по происхождению слов, обозначавших разные явления "буржуазной культуры". А слово "кайф" было похоже на английское, поэтому оно быстро распространилось и стало модным, наравне с впервые появившимися в русском языке словами "битник", "джинсы" и "рок-н-ролл".

Позже, в 70-е годы, слова с корнем "кайф" были настолько популярны, что использовались в разных несвойственных им сегодня значениях, например: "кайфануть" - потерять сознание, "откайфоваться" - умереть и т. д.

Очень быстро слово "кайф" проникло в жаргон наркоманов в значении "любой наркотик, наркотики вообще". Отсюда возникают малопонятные окружающим фразы типа "У него в сумке полно кайфа", "Он променял плейер на кайф" и т. п. Соответственно, "кайфовать" в речи наркоманов означает "находиться под воздействием наркотиков", "кайфовый" - "оказывающий наркотическое воздействие", ну и т. д.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: The word "kef" or "kayf" in Russian: -

fetteredwolf, 2009-08-07 07:00 pm UTC

Re: The word "kef" or "kayf" in Russian: -

antidos, 2009-08-09 02:39 pm UTC

Re: The word "kef" or "kayf" in Russian: -

aunt_becca, 2009-08-07 07:14 pm UTC

Re: The word "kef" or "kayf" in Russian: -

fetteredwolf, 2009-08-07 09:48 pm UTC

Re: The word "kef" or "kayf" in Russian: -

onionsoupmix, 2009-08-09 05:52 am UTC

	fetteredwolf 2009-08-07 06:48 pm UTC (link)
	Re door number 4: I've heard that friendship story before. As a kid, it's thrilling- murder! blood! dead goats! But as an adult, it's merely extremely disturbing. A true friend would not help me do something morally wrong. I would hope. Edited at 2009-08-07 06:48 pm UTC (Reply to this)

	tatianalarina 2009-08-07 06:54 pm UTC (link)
	The first one is hilarious. I loved this part: "These are influences which have creeped (sic) in from the outside world from goyim and l'havdil modern orthodoxy and Flatbush style." !!! (Reply to this)

fetteredwolf
2009-08-07 07:12 pm UTC (link)

Oh! And re door number 3: I'm pretty sure they are just taking goyishe stories and putting in Jewish names. They don't even do that good a job of switching the names: Moishe is suddenly Bob and Raizy is Gail. And what about the scenarios?
I mean, if the husband is playing poker with his friends and the "you aren't the regular pizza delivery guy" shows up, can't you make it a bit more Jewish by having the husband be at a shiur? ;)

Edited to change the door number. I keep getting them mixed up!

Edited at 2009-08-07 09:45 pm UTC

(Reply to this)

ymarkov
2009-08-07 09:08 pm UTC (link)

The "funny" thing about #4 is that IMHO the author is correct. This is how a true friend should behave - in a country where a Jew (or whoever the subject is) can't get a fair shake from the courts. Not here. I think this betrays an "us vs. them" mentality. And also "the law shouldn't matter when you're doing a mitzva", which is something I myself frequently observe in some Jewish non-profits.

And #2 - thanks for the site. I had no idea that porn addiction can be so damn powerful and destructive. Wow. Canceling nidda is not going to help these poor souls.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	(Anonymous) 2009-08-08 09:47 pm UTC (link)
	You know, the first time I heard this story was my a muslim iranian who had nothing to do with judaism. So I suppose it is a classical oriental story. (Reply to this) (Parent)

(no subject) -

onionsoupmix, 2009-08-09 03:04 am UTC

	lovable, delightful, clueless fuzzball (Anonymous) 2009-08-07 10:25 pm UTC (link)
	It would be amusing if this were an actual LJ poll. (Reply to this)

	(Anonymous) 2009-08-09 12:35 pm UTC (link)
	Door #1 wins hands down... Seriously, this attitude causes a lot of human suffering. Think about the poor spouse and the children of that crazy individual who does not permit fun. (Reply to this)

(Anonymous)
2009-08-09 09:40 pm UTC (link)

I think door #2 needs to actually seek proper help (as in get taken away to a high security mental institute) as nothing is actually going to cure his sickness. He has zero respect for women in general and that is why he has the mind of a serial rapist. I also don't see how he manages to cure himself just by keeping away from wal-mart, sounds like he doesn't want to do any errands as i am sure the minute he walks out his front door he will be bombarded with oy vey untznius issues and his crazy sickness will come back.
So there is no hope for this guy and i think for everyone's safety it's better he is put away.

Door #1 is fantastic. I do feel for them, but as they are not me i say "go ahead and live your life of crap". They will obviously never have enjoyment out of life and that is truly a sin, but not to worry because the rebbe said so.

Door #3 is very disturbing...disturbing that they actually wasted time to put that stuff on a website and disturbing that people actually are interested enough to read it.

Door#4 Is the irrational mind of the extremist rabbi nutter who truly believes in what he is saying. Sadly alot of other frummers believe the same thing and it will never change until one of their big rabbis actually says anything...which they never will. So they will continuously be caught and made into an embarassment. Talk about chillul Hashem, they are the masters of it.
R

PS; I prefer door 2

(Reply to this)

joshuazelinsky
2009-08-09 10:26 pm UTC (link)

It really is hard to say. There are different types of craziness. The point that is being made in 4 actually makes some minimal sense: certainly it isn't unique to the frum world to think that friendship is in part the willingness to put the good of the friend over ones ethical and moral obligations. WThat's wrong, and at minimum pretty obviously not a Jewish attitude (except of course, when trying to justify why frum people did bad things). But this view isn't a problem with frummness, it is a problem with humans. There may be a maturity issue here as well: Little children seem fond of the "if you were really my friend you would do _" argument.

Door number 1 is pretty crazy, but I'm not inclined to describe it as the most crazy because I would have likely subscribed to views not so far away from those when I was in my most frum stages. However, even in those stages, I think I would have told this person that there's nothing wrong with enjoying oneself when one is doing something that accomplishes a goal (something this individual seems to think is not ok).

Door number three is pretty sane: Very typical human behavior. Although the level of effort these people are going to to discuss their adultery while staying frum is interesting. I presume that most of these people are people who don't actually believe but find it easier to stay at least nominally frum.

So I guess from process of eliminator, door number 2?

(Reply to this)

Glowing_flower says...
(Anonymous)
2009-08-11 03:20 am UTC (link)

#1 is scary because it's so true. Also, I'm wondering how you could ask the Rebbe, as the article advises.

I actually think #2 is satirical. I'm surprised no one else read it that way.

I'm not clicking on #3, so I can't vote on that.

As for #4, there's nobody I'm burying a dead body for. I think calling 911 is the best thing a true friend would do in this case, because if there is some defense for your actions, it disappears (in the mind of a jury) the moment you try to hide the crime.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	Re: Glowing_flower says... onionsoupmix 2009-08-11 10:55 am UTC (link)
	Satirical? No, read the rest of the site, it is not satirical. It is just sad. (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: Glowing_flower says... - (Anonymous), 2009-08-11 09:04 pm UTC

Re: Glowing_flower says... - (Anonymous), 2009-08-11 11:57 am UTC

	(Anonymous) 2009-08-11 02:29 pm UTC (link)
	If fun is too goyish for chabad, then what's up with all the l'chaims and dancing? Should purim be cancelled because its too much fun? What about summer camp? (Reply to this) (Thread)

	(Anonymous) 2009-08-11 06:02 pm UTC (link)
	You can always rename it suffercamp and poor-I-m (Reply to this) (Parent)

(Anonymous)
2009-08-13 02:54 pm UTC (link)

I'm not touching #3 with a 10 ft pole, so I'm voting for #4.

Weird religious interpretations or personal sexual issues aren't as damaging IMHO as stating in public that "love your neighbour" means being an accessory to murder.

As I said elsewhere - if someone seems to have an obscene amount of money and is accused of some heavy-duty fraud by the FBI and tells you that the FBI have frozen his assets and asks you to illegally funnel money to him through your charity....can you really be surprised when - GASP! - he turns out to be a dishonest guy willing to hurt others to further his own interests?

JRKmommy

(Reply to this)

	But ... (Anonymous) 2009-08-13 06:38 pm UTC (link)
	This first edict only applies to bachurim. According to a famous kabalist, it is "ipcha mistabra" for girls, who "just want to have fun" (Ayin haitev b'sefer shirei Esther, v'dok). (Reply to this) (Thread)

	Re: But ... onionsoupmix 2009-08-13 06:42 pm UTC (link)
	very cute. What is the deeper meaning of "material girl" and "like a virgin"? (Reply to this) (Parent)

Shalmo
(Anonymous)
2009-08-13 09:32 pm UTC (link)

Interview with the Shaindy founder: http://www.jewcy.com/post/meet_shaindycom

Question: As someone who is religious yourself, do you feel at all this is going "against" your religion?

Answer: Well, that’s a whole separate interview but here goes it. I was "brought" up religious but I believe in SHIT basically. So, I have no GUILT in me whatsoever. I find many, many, many people sharing the same beliefs as myself.

-----

This reinforces my belief that Judaism is the most nonsensical religion this planet has ever produced. Even frum Jews themselves don't take it seriously.

If you actually go asking around in the Orthodox world how many actually believe in the 13 ikkaram or any of the core doctrines of Orthodoxy the vast majority will tell you an honest "no". The actual believers, even among those practising Orthodoxy, are smaller than most realize.

Those sky-rocketing rates of intermarriage and assimilation thus should come as no surprise to anyone. Nobody takes Judaism seriously, not even its own followers. Hence why when given freedom of religion, we see that Judaism fails miserably to hold on to adherants. Enough said....hypocrites!!!

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	Re: Shalmo onionsoupmix 2009-08-14 02:15 am UTC (link)
	why do you think islam is any different? There are always the "recovering catholics" and the off the derech Jews. You are foolish to think that there aren't people disenchanted with any religion. (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Shalmo - (Anonymous), 2009-08-14 04:18 am UTC

Re: Shalmo - (Anonymous), 2009-08-14 04:53 am UTC

Re: Shalmo -

onionsoupmix, 2009-08-14 06:00 am UTC

Re: Shalmo - (Anonymous), 2009-08-14 09:33 am UTC

Re: Shalmo -

onionsoupmix, 2009-08-14 11:19 am UTC

Shalmo - (Anonymous), 2009-08-15 02:05 am UTC

Re: Shalmo -

onionsoupmix, 2009-08-16 01:45 am UTC

Re: Shalmo - (Anonymous), 2009-08-16 02:54 pm UTC

Shalmo - (Anonymous), 2009-08-14 09:26 am UTC

	Shalmo (Anonymous) 2009-08-14 09:49 am UTC (link)
	Oh and onion please tone down the ad hominems. Unlike your best friend "Jewish Philosopher" I don't throw insults related to your weight at you, so show some courtesy back. We're all adults here. Besides we have a good thing going. I bring drama and excitement to your blog, and in return I get to blow off steam on the frum world. Everybody wins! (Reply to this)

Shalmo
(Anonymous)
2009-08-15 06:50 pm UTC (link)

you said you wanted stats on my claims about orthodox jews, well please read this:

http://www.threejews.net/2008/09/will-your-grandchildren-be-reform.html

The highlight of the article is the Orthodox attrition rate. Orthodox Judaism has the highest attrition imaginable. Of all children raised Orthodox only, believe it or not, 42% stayed orthodox. This literally means more people leave orthodoxy than stay in it.

This adds to everything I have been saying about orthodoxy, that even most orthodox jews don't belief in it hence why the majority switch denominations.

Its still not too late for you to join that reform congregation onion. Take the husband and kids with you when you go :)

(Reply to this)

(84 comments) - (Post a new comment)

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